Josh Barnett
It is no secret that I am not a Josh Barnett fan. Before I became the writer that you all know and love, I would compose open letters to certain MMA personalities that I took issue with, one of which is Barnett. Well this past weekend immediately after UFC 141, I became a Josh Barnett fan. At the DREAM New Years Eve event in Japan, he showcased his professional wrestling skills against Hideki Suzuki. For those of us who pulled off the incredible 15 hour marathon that evening/morning, the Barnett wrestling match was one of the highlights of the night.
Barnett and Suzuki put on an absolute clinic working some fantastic professional wrestling spots into a lot of technical grappling. Though it was an obvious work, Michael Schiavello calls the action as if the two were in fact having an MMA fight.
Among the high spots:
1 recs | 145 comments
The best way...
I can describe it is “dramatized MMA fight.”
Sergio Hernandez - January 3, 2012
Rescue 911 reenactment
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
So long Bloody Elbow.
The assholery drove me away from mmamania, but its the pro wrestling driving me away from BE.
Too much, Mr Roth, regardless if those involved are MMA fighters.
It’s been emotional.
irish-chris - January 3, 2012 via mobile
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
Irish you the best of luck on your journey to sherdog
Don’t let the door hit you where the good lord split you!
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
It involved MMA fighters on the biggest MMA card of the year in the birthplace of modern MMA.
I can see getting pissed off about the coverage of Brock’s WWE career, but like it or not, what happens on a NYE show in Japan is MMA news. Period.
Steve4192 - January 3, 2012
I apologize
I hope you accept this as an apology.
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
Reccing the f*** outta this.
esquilinho - January 3, 2012
hahaha
Robert V-U - January 3, 2012
Rob Young - January 3, 2012
It's stuff like this that makes me think Dana will bring Barnett to the UFC for sure.
He’s too valuable for the Japan cards to not be on their roster.
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
Oh my gosh
So much win here, great post Roth
Robert V-U - January 3, 2012
Barnett is very interesting
I ran across him when he identified the Matt Hughes headlock on Ricardo Almeida as the “Dan Schultz headlock” and been following him since. He has an interesting history in Japan, coaching Megumi Fujii and such. He’s a good showman and excellent fighter. Would love to see him more. I think him against Frank Mir would be great.
Watching replays of the fight it was funny to see the HDNet guys being absolutely lost in how to announce the fight.
closetasfan - January 3, 2012
Mir v Barnett
That would be great. Both guys would sell the shit outta that fight too.
LenBarson - January 3, 2012
This shit would be a lot less lame if they didn’t wear what are more or less speedos.
dynamitelungs - January 3, 2012
LOL WAT
Those are Barnett’s normal fight shorts (style) for MMA and plenty of fighters in JMMA and early NAMMA brawl(ed) in grapple panties.
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
Wrestling in general. Too many speedos. 1/2 in this fight.
dynamitelungs - January 3, 2012
Funny,
my main problem with prowrestling is that the speedos aren’t a rule. They should be a rule.
bigstupidsmile - January 3, 2012
C’mon son!
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
For this I won’t follow you bro.
spectaa - January 3, 2012
Man, if the banana hammock is your scene, I won’t knock you for it. Just not for me.
Don’t hate.
dynamitelungs - January 3, 2012
Brian Ebersole, welcome to BE.
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
Roth, what was better? This or Jericho’s return last night?
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
Jericho's return was bawse
Thats It For you! - January 3, 2012
The greatest thing ever.
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
I loved Jericho's return
because so many people got mad. It was hilarious because he just kept it going and was more of a mark for himself than the rest of the crowd. It honestly was brilliant.
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
WHAT
the HELL is this?? I’m not american hence the lack of interest in Pro Wrestling, but this was just really bad. I must be missing something.
Norreshizzle - January 3, 2012
probably a brain
Robert V-U - January 3, 2012
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
Like the only pro wrestling fans are in america… you’re misinformed or trolling.
spectaa - January 3, 2012
It was pretty stupid.
Charger567 - January 3, 2012
Only pro wrestling fans are in America,
is not what I meant, but thats where the majority are I guess.
Happy?
Norreshizzle - January 3, 2012
I don't have numbers
But there are many dramatic wrestling traditions in several countries.
WheelieMonkey - January 3, 2012
So I'll clarify,
what I meant was that Pro Wrestling is biggest in the USA. Moving on yes
Norreshizzle - January 3, 2012
No. Because Japan probably takes their pro wrestling more seriously than America. Mexico as well.
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
I'm a mark...I'll admit it!
I have been a fan of Pro Wrestling since “Macho Man” Randy Savage wrestled for ICW, his Father’s company. That said, I was impressed by his work, as well. The match did have a slow start as both men tried to find their pace, but the spots Barnett put down were damn near flawless in their execution. A lot of people who aren’t fans don’t know that they rarely rehearse a match move for move. There is discussion of spots, what the end scenario will be (Let’s go home) and of course, who’s going to win or lose. It was fun to see an MMA guy who is currently active showing off, especially for the highly respective fans of Japan. It was a nice intermission, if you will, from the rest of the action of the night. Haters gonna hate, and fans, well, watch the video. Not bad for a greenhorn!
Mr. Socko - January 3, 2012 via mobile
IGF is good for technical, submission wrestling-like matches like this. Of course, old school UWFi is the go-to for that style.
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
What’s the difference between the two Japanese promotions in terms of style, and which is the easier to enjoy as an outsider?
GreyedOut - January 3, 2012
UWFi Bushido was worked hybrid rules fighting.
Predetermined but very stiff, submissions or KO from slams, no pins but a depreciative scoring system.
If I remember right both fighters start with 10 or 15 points, and points are taken away form rope breaks to get out of subs, or if the opponent lands a really good throw on you.
Here’s a trailer video:
KJ Gould - January 3, 2012
So IGF is the successor to the UWF style?
And is New Japan closer to WWE style of pro-wrestling?
GreyedOut - January 3, 2012
As far as I understand New Japan is more storyline based
but it’s still pretty stiff.
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
Hustle is closer to the WWE style
I don’t think it’s particularly popular in Japan either. But I don’t know that for sure.
KJ Gould - January 3, 2012
Hustle was big for a while
They’d run the Saitama Super Arena, and a lot of other big arenas, but they would heavily paper their attendances. Weren’t selling enough tickets, too many big names who were overpaid. New Japan is far and away the most popular puroresu company at the moment.
crazedfan - January 3, 2012
Hustle was kind of fun for me
but i was more of a NOAH fan myself. New Japan certainly is king of the hill right now.
Victor Rodriguez - January 3, 2012
Goddamn! That was awesome!
Good luck convincing the kid me that wasn’t fake/staged!
GreyedOut - January 3, 2012
I hope you're the real Mick Foley
BE could use a Mick Foley.
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
Heh heh heh
Mick Foley is my role model, NOT for his ring work, but his relentless determination to do what he loved, despite his physical limitations. His mic work was legendary, and Hell In A Cell scared the Beejeezus out of me. But I’m just a hick from the sticks, nothing more, nothing less.
Mr. Socko - January 3, 2012 via mobile
Ok Mick, I mean notMick.
BE loves you… er him.
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
That’s not how you do it, you’re supposed to say: “IT WAS A JOKE!”
spectaa - January 3, 2012
I’m way to entangled in this now, I will put a cone on my head and sit in the corner of the room. BRB
Norreshizzle - January 3, 2012
You are laughably misinformed.
Pro wrestling is MUCH bigger in Japan, Mexico, and Canada than it is in the USA. Also, even the WWE makes FAR more profit per event on their foreign shows than make on domestic shows (something in the realm of four times more). Wrestling is NOT just a USA thing.
Steve4192 - January 3, 2012
Dude…get this. This pro wrestling thing…they have it all around the world! Fucking crazy, right?!
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
To be fair though...
…it’s a pretty fringe interest outside of Japan and the Americas. Was very popular here in the UK when i was a teenager in the 90s but it’s died a death here since then and I’m fairly sure none of the rest of Europe have ever had much interest. Is it popular in Asia outside of Japan?
Mattyjudo - January 3, 2012 via Android app
No idea. It’s popular in Mexico, the US and Japan. But in the US its really a small niche, I mean like I think more people watch NHL than prowrestling
Robert V-U - January 3, 2012
The U.S. goes through phases with it. It was pretty big in the 50’s. Then you had the 80’s boom with Hulk Hogan and all. Then you had the Attitude Era from 1997 to 2001 or so. Now we are in a lull.
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
Interesting insight. My association with prowrestling involves my familiarity with the wrestlers that move on from just being a wrestler, ie Lesnar, Lashley, the Rock, im blanking beyond this
Robert V-U - January 3, 2012
NHL posts low ratings all the time…WWE has been posting better ratings than the Stanley Cup Finals for going on 14 years. Sorry, but hockey only exists in the towns the teams are in. I’ve lived in two hockey towns (St. Louis and Chicago). Nobody 100 south north east or west really cares what those teams do. Check Nielsen if you don’t believe me. Now TNA wrestling posts shite ratings. Average rating for NHL this year: 1.1 in the Nielsens…WWE RAW: 3.21 in the Nielsens.
Mr. Socko - January 3, 2012 via mobile
Had no idea. I am from San Jose (Sharks territory) and live with a huge hockey fan, so my perception is distorted. Not an NHL fan myself however
Robert V-U - January 3, 2012
I liked it. pro wrestling is cool minus the brain dead yelling and stuff…and i guess some of that is ok too.
Hardy's in your face - January 3, 2012
None of that is ok.
Luke Thomas - January 3, 2012
FAKE WRESTLING > BORING WRESTLING.
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
Depends what you mean by 'boring'
There was nothing boring about the NCAA Division I tournament in Philly last year.
KJ Gould - January 3, 2012
Ric Flair > Jordan Boroughs
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
Only in being a high stylin', profilin', limousine riding ...
jet flying, kiss-stealing, wheelin’ n’ dealin’ son of a gun!
KJ Gould - January 3, 2012
DIAMONDS ARE FOREVER AND SO IS RIC FLAIR!
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
WOOOOOOOO!!!!
[Struggles to force ruined body into the ring, makes it in by dropping dead weight (dignity)]
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
Yeah
Ric Flair looks like he’s wearing a skin suit.
SentientAndroid - January 3, 2012
TO BE THE MAN, YOU GOTTA BEAT THE MAN! WOOOOOOO! Thanks Matthew, glad to see an MMA writer who doesn’t take themselves TOO seriously! Now if you’ll excuse me, I’ve gotta go powerbomb the old lady!
Mr. Socko - January 3, 2012 via mobile
MATTHEW ROTH WHY R U SUCH A NICE GUY IN INTERVIEWS, BUT UR WRITING IS SO MOTHERASSHOLEFUCK AUHHHH …… sadpanda
yellopanda - January 4, 2012
Only pro wrestling fans are in America,
is not what I meant, but thats where the majority are I guess.
Happy?
Norreshizzle - January 3, 2012
Pro wrestling is more popular worldwide than MMA
Seriously, check out the breakdown of UFC/WWE numbers in the new issue of the Meltzer’s Observer newsletter. Obviously, “UFC” doesn’t equal “MMA” and WWE doesn’t equate to all pro wrestling, but even taking that into account, it seems clear that pro wrestling is more popular.
Jeff D. - January 3, 2012
I miss your open letters.
Just because it offended so many people for some reason.
av1o3 - January 3, 2012
KIM COUTURE IS A SAINT! YOU UNDERSTAND ME?! KIM COUTURE IS A SAINT!
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
what BE needs right now, is an open letter about how posters should get on with prowrestling and let Roth do his thing
Robert V-U - January 3, 2012
i love the Japanese attitude to pro wrestling and MMA.
Its not 200% all about the win.
Kevin Jennison J. Zametov-St Pierre - January 3, 2012
This pro wrestling match is so different from american matches. Wheres the folding chair head smashing action? where are the ladders and throwing the guy into the ropes where he continues to run and gets clothes lined?
terzergoss - January 3, 2012
They brought out the chair for Saku, it wasn’t the best moment of the night for me, but i was so tired at that point i couldve been hallucinating
Robert V-U - January 3, 2012
They brought out the chair, but it was used in just a weird way.
GreyedOut - January 3, 2012
Oh No!!! Roth is doing another wrestling article!! Run for your lives!!!!
In all seriousness, I haven’t looked at the video yet, but the Northern Lights Suplex is a thing of beauty.
You don’t see them (suplexes) too often in MMA matches but when there done, they are exciting to see…..
jack knight starman - January 3, 2012
I may be wrong. it may be a hangman suplex.
Either way it’s fucking awesome.
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012 via iPhone app
Definitely trying that on my kids when I get home
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
May I direct you to the Houston Alexander story......
Cocytus - January 3, 2012
Houston Alexander is for real, your honor
Pro wrestling is fake.
The defense rests.
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
Pro wrestling is real, people are fake!
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
Judge Judy: It's still real to me damnit! FIVE YEARS, NO PAROLE!
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
“If you’re gonna lie to me, you’re gonna have to take a hangman suplex from me.”
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
Northern Lights Suplex is my favorite wrestling maneuver. I’ve always loved it. Pretty sure they could hit that in an MMA fight. Might be a way to counter a guillotine (or sink it in deeper).
feniin - January 3, 2012
I'd say chances of hitting it are 50% in a real fight
And that 50% is made up of whitebelts with 6 months jiu jitsu at most.
Hitting a side suplex is more realistic imo.
KJ Gould - January 3, 2012
Justin Beiber is pretty good at choreographed moves too...
Yet he gets no love on Bloody Elbow…whats the deal?
Chris WhiteDynamite Bielanski - January 3, 2012
Bad haircut
menckenstein - January 3, 2012
ahhh...
that explains the lack of Roy Nelson stories too then…
Chris WhiteDynamite Bielanski - January 3, 2012
You're pretty good at using overused jokes.
Yet, you get no love on Bloody Elbow…we know the deal.
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
Can’t wait to see how he responds to this gem
Robert V-U - January 3, 2012
I see what you did there...good show sir...
that aside though…I honestly prefer to see Barnett in a cage concentrated on Cormier rather than risking injury working a stiff match in Japan…Pretend wrestling I think the risk of injury is almost as prevelant as an MMA fight and it my opinion it would have been completely lame to see Barnett hurt himself in this manner
Chris WhiteDynamite Bielanski - January 3, 2012
I’m not a pro-wrestling fan and I hate the current version of WWE and such, but I have to say I actually enjoyed this match. Fast and fluent, very well executed grappling style exhibition. I also like Barnett since before so maybe that helped.
To be honest the rest of the pro-wrestling matches weren’t very good though. I have a hard time understanding why you want to throw in stand-up fighters like Le Banner and Aerts into these things, as K-1 kickboxing is already generally very high-paced and action-packed. Also Tim Sylvia’s fight was atrocious, just horrible. Would have rather seen these guys in their real sports than some botched wrasslin’ stuff.
Sakuraba’s match was okay I guess, not that impressed by it, but the post-fight “brawl” was sort of fun. Also the whole Inoki bit where he came in on the cross like Jesus, then got smacked in the head by some arabs was pretty entertaining just because it was so bizarre and hard to understand what was the point of it all.
All in all I think it was pretty fun to have these on the NYE card, if only for the novelty. I would have preferred to have more K-1 fights though. Love mixed cards!
Horselover Fat - January 3, 2012
Mixed cards and JB
Mixed cards are fun. Dream NYE is crazy entertaining
JB is a boss and his wrestling match was one of the best spectacles of the night
Robert V-U - January 3, 2012
Agreed! Loved the show overall.
You mean JLB right? HYPER BATTLE CYBORG! He’s great, just didn’t like the match he did too much. As I said though I’m not a fan of pro-wrestling in general.
Horselover Fat - January 3, 2012
Nah, the kickboxers aren’t really looking that great in IGF. Although they provide some stiff hits. The only one I’ve seen do pretty well is Jienotsu. He does some pretty cool stuff and is getting the hang of it.
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
Seems I misread Barnett for Le Banner for some reason. Well that’s good to hear about Jienotsu I guess, because he has mostly been looking like shit in real fighting ever since he won that Japan tournament. Sloppy as hell against Kikuno.
Horselover Fat - January 3, 2012
So sad Jienotsu lost his "remix" match this year
But I’ll always love him for that knee to Aoki’s head last year…
duck - January 3, 2012
He's been focusing on pro-wrestling this year
and you saw that in his stand up on Saturday morning.
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
It looked BAD
I was wondering what happened.
duck - January 3, 2012
It's also why it was a catchweight
He put on a ton of mass this year.
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
I'm cultivating mass.
alicks - January 3, 2012
Is that Robbie Lawler at 195?
tigerlee - January 3, 2012
JB = Josh Barnett?
wonderfulspam - January 3, 2012
Ohhh.. yeah
Obviously. I don’t know why I thought of Le Banner instead, guess I had him in my head.
Horselover Fat - January 3, 2012
Agreed
The fact that it was indeed a masterful display of grappling made it very enjoyable. If this had been an actual MMA fight it would’ve been absolutely insane.
wonderfulspam - January 3, 2012
JLB/Sylvia was terrible.
Tim Burke - January 3, 2012
Sylvia is even boring in fake fights.
Rob Young - January 3, 2012
Agreed
I am no fan of WWE but this was damn fun to watch, very entertaining.
To those that think it was lame…did you even watch it?
MadNachos - January 3, 2012
What I find really crazy
was the slams. Wrestling rings usually have much more give than than MMA rings so you can slam guys without killing them. The floor of that ring barely moved when Barnett dropped Suzuki.
John Nash - January 3, 2012
I wonder if this is true of all Japanese puroresu rings. Because they usually try to put an emphasis on legitimacy and stiffness of the work in-ring. Have to pay attention to that next time I catch some puro.
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
not a huge fan of pro wrestling at all but I very much enjoyed the japanese shoot style match that Barnett & Suzuki had on NYE.
Shocbomb - January 3, 2012
Atta boy, Roth
Tim Burke - January 3, 2012
Also, I really like this acceptance of pro wrestling and MMA and coverage of the crossovers. I get my balls busted for it over at Gals Guide, but it is so awesome. Good job, Roth.
mountaineers101 - January 3, 2012
I don't think there's acceptance though
I’m just pushing it. Because I like it and I want everyone to like it too.
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
This match was the highlight of the event for me.
alicks - January 3, 2012
Suzuki didn't let my dawg hit the captured buster
Forrest Lynn - January 3, 2012
Schiavello calling it as legit made it even better
IRodC - January 3, 2012
Wouldn't mind seeing him work for the WWE (won't happen).
He just needs to learn a few appropriate names for moves etc, and I think he would already be better than anyone else sitting behind a mic.
bigstupidsmile - January 3, 2012
I'd like him and Lawler to be honest
that’d be a great booth if they had chemistry.
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
Also because fuck Michael Cole
IRodC - January 3, 2012
Anything to get Michael Cole outta there. Schiavallo said his inspiration was Gorrilla Monsoon (RIP) so I think that Lawler would work well with him, because of the respect Michael has for the industry. Nobody beats Gorrilla and Heenan together though. Best booth ever. sigh Please let Vince read this! HAHAHAAA!
Mr. Socko - January 3, 2012 via mobile
If this is what Japanese Pro Wrestling is
I like it.
esquilinho - January 3, 2012
Puroresu is for you
IRodC - January 3, 2012
BRAAAAAAINBUSTAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
bigstupidsmile - January 3, 2012
¡Olé!
S.S - January 4, 2012
I wonder if this is what the early Rings/Shooto matches looked like…….
jack knight starman - January 3, 2012
Nope.
bigstupidsmile - January 3, 2012
Wow, you really love some Pro Wrasslin’. I enjoyed some of the technical aspects of it the bout. But it’s still fake, so still not that cool. Liked the hell out of it when I was 11 though.
kick_puncher - January 3, 2012
Since most people didn't say up for 15 hours like myself
I figured it should get posted. It was honestly the best part of DREAM. Beside Jesus Inoki.
Matthew Roth - January 3, 2012
JESUS INOKI BROKE MY BRAIN AT THAT EARLY HOUR.
I loved it.
bigstupidsmile - January 3, 2012
You may not like one style of pro wrestling but there are many to choose from
Puroresu – A rougher version where people get hit really fuckin hard
Lucha Libre – Mostly from mexico, high flying acrobatic maneuvers everywhere you look, plus cools masks
WWE style- Which is what most of you know as prowrestling
There are others but those are the most basic styles
IRodC - January 3, 2012
exactly!
jack knight starman - January 3, 2012
I used to be a big pro wrestling fan when I was younger up until about 8 years ago…..
Like yourself I still enjoy some of the technical aspects of it but I know wayyyyy….. wayyyyyyy…. back when Japanese orgs Shooto and Rings even before the UFC was up and running these orgs were doing semi/shoot/legit MMA before there was even an MMA so I can apprieciate the “bridge” that they started.
If Page can power bomb Arona way back in Pride and it’s done (or at least used to) be done in pro wrestling from way back when I enjoy seeing things like that….
That’s just me of course…..
jack knight starman - January 3, 2012
The changes that be has gone through over this last few months/yeah have made me want to kill myself. Obviously you all are still here so this opinion will be unpopular, but the quality has gone down so so much. Nostalgia keeps me here along with the awesome community and the occasional good post. I feel like i’m going through the “I can’t believe I didn’t see the signs!” portion of a breakup :’(
Hendo_One-Shot - January 3, 2012
Now excuse my as I watch my “Ultimate Jon Fitch” Dvd until I peacefully leave the earth.
Hendo_One-Shot - January 3, 2012
Good for you! Never give up!
jack knight starman - January 3, 2012 via mobile
At least its not “Bitch gave me herpes” portion of a break up
Art_Wanderlei - January 3, 2012
Is that when I get banned?
Hendo_One-Shot - January 3, 2012
I don’t know I’m all out of reltionship metaphors at the moment try for make up sex?
Art_Wanderlei - January 3, 2012
Roth - A Request...
Can you explain what the hell was going on during the intermission when Inoki came in on a cross and was then beaten by Persians with a cane? That was totally lost in translation for me and the Hanslator just did not help.
tigerlee - January 3, 2012
Here's what I know
Inoki was talking about the hard times Japan has gone through as a country, but also for MMA and Pro Wrestling.
Inoki loves using allegory and weird historical references. It could be the whole cross thing was a metaphor for resurrection, which he hopes to see Japan, Pro Wrestling and MMA go through.
As for the Persians – they weren’t Persians. They were Indian Sikhs, but of more relevance it was Tiger Jeet Singh – a long time rival of Inoki’s in the Pro Wrestling days – and his son Tiger Ali Singh, who had been in WWF on a few occasions but never succeeded there.
Tiger Ali Singh was holding a photo of Umanosuke Ueda who had recently passed away. I believed Tiger Jeet Singh tagged with Ueda, and so coming out to Inoki storyline wise was extending an olive branch of sorts.
Storyline wise, Tiger Ali Singh attacked Inoki because of the long time feud his dad and Inoki were in.
KJ Gould - January 4, 2012
Thanks KJ
I was sick, on several medications, and it was the middle of the night…suffice to say I was terribly confused. I knew there was an obvious pro wrestling skit going on but for the life of me couldn’t figure it out…and the commentary crew only muddled it up further. Where’s Mean Gene Okerlund when you need him?!
tigerlee - January 4, 2012
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