UFC 143 Carlos Condit Vs. Nick Diaz Judges' Score Cards
Everyone who watched UFC 143's welterweight interim title fight between Nick Diaz and Carlos Condit had their own score in their heads. Nick Diaz clearly thought he won the fight, apparently retiring in a snit after the loss. But only three people's opinions mattered and they all agreed that Carlos Condit won the fight. Here are each judges' round-by-round scores:
Judge Cecil Peoples had it: 10-9, 10-9, 9-10, 10-9, 10-9 for Condit.
Judge Patricia Morse Jarman had it: 10-9, 10-9, 9-10, 10-9, 10-9 for Condit.
Judge Junichiro Kamijo had it 10-9, 9-10, 10-9, 10-9, 9-10 for Condit.
Some interesting things to note. First off it's pretty amazing that only one judge scored the final round for Diaz given the take down and back mount. Secondly, it's interesting that only Kamijo had Diaz winning the second but Jarman and Peoples had Diaz winning the third. Everyone agreed that Condit won the first and fourth rounds.
Dana White scored it three rounds to two for Condit, with Diaz winning the first two and Condit the final three.
CompuStrike counted the strikes in the bout like so:
Condit outlanded Diaz in total strikes 146 to 110
Diaz outlanded Condit 86 to 42 in total arm strikes landed
Condit outlanded Diaz 104 to 19 in total leg strikes landed
He thought the takedown wasn’t a big deal, and i understand, because he’s a boxing guy… and maybe the judges have been hearing so much shit about takedowns not being a big deal, that they decided that wasn’t a big deal.
Obviously this was a different sort of takedown, which immediately became a back mount.
But fuck.. don’t let it go to the judges!
1 1/2 min on the ground,leaves 3 1/2 minutes that he got his ass kicked. So if you control a guy for 1 1/2 min , you lose to the guy that controlled you for 3 1/2 minutes in my book for sure. Thats the way i saw it for real,bro!
How many of those ‘hard low kicks’ did Condit land? Do you really think ANYONE could take that many ‘hard’ kicks to the leg? So how did Diaz retain his ability to move forward? Because most of those kicks were not hard.
Condit turned the match into point sparring and was rewarded with a belt.
and Nick wasn’t moving forward, or throwing aggressively in the later rounds. In fact he looked downright passive. Creep forward, get hit, lunge with wild punches, miss, rinse repeat, leg kick, creep forward, throw, get cracked, etc. That was the vast majority of the fight.
in the later rounds, hardly throwing, passively waiting on Carlos, and getting schooled the entire time until he finally managed to get it to the ground. Where were you? Carlos landed first the entire time, and Nick’s right leg was jelly by the 4th.
Only round that’s really debatable was the fifth. Moving forward without landing is like a kamikaze charge, you look proud and brave but you’re getting carved up.
because he is an otherworldly tough motherfucker. But he noticeably slowed down the more the low kicks accrued, and the more the rounds dragged on. Carlos buckled him with a low kick in the championship rounds!
It wasn’t point sparring, it’s called striking. Diaz’ face doesn’t look like ground beef right now because Carlos was throwing little girl punches and kicks.
but he could’ve changed the rhythym of the fight and done some damage. He just kept on with the same tired act, even after it was apparent that Carlos wasn’t going to lose his cool. I know Nick acted like he wasn’t hurt, he won, he got “ran from” but from where I sat, he got beat on for much of the fight, lost his initiative due to the leg kicks and counters, and did little but posture while refusing to alter his tactics. Oh well, I wanted and thought Carlos would win, but I was pretty disappointed in Nick, not to mention the post-fight.
I was just getting to like him again, and there are SO many good fights for him, most of which he’ll win. Carlos composure and ability to laugh off the taunts with vicious kicks in response isn’t something too many guys will replicate.
Josh is the kind of guy who seems susceptible to talk, who’ll get pissed off and wade in rather than imposing his wrestling, but we’ve seen him psychologically rope-a-dope Daley that way, by keeping his cool and just winning. It could look similar, but Nick at least has the ground game to be a huge threat there.
Those lead low kicks were snapping Nick’s legs around considerably. j
And do you realize that Nick only landed 8 power shots to the head? Diaz did much better work to the body than the head. Carlos actually outlanded Nick in power strikes to the head.
And so do my eyes. Nick had one moment the whole fight where he beat up Carlos to the body. Other than that he landed a few good punches, while eating far more of them, and getting hammered to the leg and body to the point that he couldn’t push forward in the later rounds, and his reaction time and aggression were shot.
Diaz didn’t GET the RNC on Condit. Nor did he land any hard strikes from that position. Nor did he finish an armbar.
I don’t think a fighter should be rewarded for failing to lock in a submission, no more than a fighter should be rewarded for shutting down that submission attempt.
Submissions are completely hit or miss. You either draw the tap, or you don’t. In some cases, you can crank a submission hold and do considerable damage without getting a submission (physical/ verbal tapout, or technical submission), but you still do some serious damage (Marshall breaking Vera’s arm with the armbar comes to mind, Dos Anjos’ round 2 calf slicer on Tyson Griffin that made him limp the rest of the fight).
But Diaz did zero damage with that RNC attempt. It’s not like he was crushing Condit’s face or anything.
You must break through the fog of lies the Jedi Unified Rules have created around you. Let me help you to know the subtleties of the Force fight game. It is unavoidable. With each passing moment you make yourself more my servant!
if a fighter was really close on finishing a submission, I think there should be points for that. If they just do nothing but attempt at a sub but is shut down, then they get no points.
is a ‘saved by the bell’ situation. I think that the rules need to be changed so that a fighter has to fight his way out of a submission before they can break for the round.
it has to be a point, consistently, to buck the trend of having a few “fouls to give”, though I thought two was harsh, and a bitter pill for Alex after a pretty hugely improved performance. Dominant last two rounds.
Herb took control all over the board tonight, though I did think Kos should lose a point. People might complain based on precedent, but Herb set it to a degree tonight. For years, the punishment for repeated illegal strikes have been ignored, with the result that people know they have a few get out of jail free cards. A few more performances like that from Herb, and you won’t see that shit when he’s in there. Hope the other refs take his lead.
but that seems like a trend in all the refs. I really LOVED him taking a strong stand against the “fouls to give” mentality some guys have. I realize most fouls are unintentional, but once you’ve been warned once, it should always be a point. You have to be accurate, and while Alex looked much improved, he’s still a wildman out there to a degree. You can’t just throw with no regard for where they land, and I hope Herb blazes the path with that. Also, the way he handled Figueroa’s time to recover, the warnings to Kos, though they should’ve resulted in a point IMO. Apart from resetting too aggressively, I thought Herb’s performance should be a standard to apply.
Yeah, coming from a guy whose username is "sweet scientist."
You’re a good poster, and I’m not personally attacking you, but it’s obvious that you have a bias for boxing. Which is fine, we all have our preferences.
But I don’t think there’s any doubt that Condit landed the harder, cleaner, more numerous strikes throughout the fight.
Honestly I’m not bitching about the decision, and it’s true that I tend to weigh boxing a bit more. Anything from 49-46 Condit to 48-47 Diaz is reasonable for me.
no score giving this to Diaz is reasonable. Moving forward doesn’t matter when you’re getting owned nearly every time you do, unless you’re Leonard Garcia.
To give Condit the 5th round is pretty bad in my eyes. I scored it 48-47 Diaz, with him winning 1, 2, and 5. I could see giving Condit round 1 or 2, as they were pretty close. But round 5 to Condit?
xxvi. Timidity, including, without limitation, avoiding contact with an opponent, intentionally or consistently dropping the mouthpiece or faking an injury
Ref should have issued warning for Condit turning is back and running.
Moving blindly straight forward is no measure of “winning” in any form of combat, from large scale armies to hand to hand, in any of human history. In fact, it’s been shown to be utterly stupid when confronted by an equal opposition. Carlos just sniped him while Nick bitched, talked and took a beating.
You would be better off walking around your house punching some walls to let off some steam than to come on the internet and quote the unified rules in an illogical and incongruent fashion to support your trash hypothesis and make a fool of yourself.
Condit did NOT avoid contact (he landed hundreds of strikes on Diaz, more than Diaz did in return) and he sure as shit did not spit out his mouthpiece or fake an injury.
Avoiding damage while inflicting it is not against the rules. So tell me, why the fuck should the ref have issued a warning again?
Except all the time he ran away with his back to Nick Looking over his shoulder.
Jackson MMA has turned these fights into humping or running matches. Enjoy Ultimate Legkick running if thats what you like, but i believe he was breaking the spirit of that rule I listed when it comes to timidity. First thing he did was timidly explain it was all his corner’s idea after the fight too.
So many lurkers popped up out of no where to complain that the fight was a “robbery”. I think I found the one thing I hate more than Nick Diaz. His stupid, fucking fans.
For some reason I changed Natal by UD to the other dude by tko. I thought he was going to do it in the third, but it just wasn’t meant to be. I also picked Pierce, and that backfired.
I changed Kuiper from tko in the second to Natal by UD. Talk about coincidence. I walked away with 98 points tonight. I lost on Caceres (I thought he won the decision) and Nick.
Hopefully DFW says he doesnt agree with the judging
Sets up an immediate rematch and Diaz figures out a way to counter or keep Condit from escaping to the left with his head down eveytime he’s pressed against the cage.
but they were landing and stopping Nick in his tracks for the majority of the fight. Nick snapped Carlos head back a few times, and beat him up to the body for about ten seconds total, but he also ran into plenty of hard jabs and elbows. You can criticize Carlos committment and metaphysical sense of their impact on Nick’s being, whereas I can just say that Nick missed most of the time.
You saw what you wanted to see I guess. Personally, I saw Carlos running for 3 rounds. He settled down in 4-5 and fought well. I’d give it 48-47 Diaz to be fair to his leg jabs.
Interestingly, if we judged this fight on Nick’s own criteria (i.e. who’s face was more fucked up after the fight), surely Diaz would have to concede that he had the bigger shiner under his right eye?
In that neither guy really did a whole lot of damage with their power shots. At the time, I thought Condit should have won, but that the judges would favour Nick for walking forward. Condit did a good job circling away from the power shots and chopping away at Nick.
The way I see it is that aggressiveness is only a deciding factor when it is effective. This fight was the equivalent of two fencers going at it, one swinging for the fences and the other picking his shots.
Diaz lost half the fight to BJ kind of like how he lost last night (his opponent moving away from his grizzlie bear attack), until he finally backed BJ against the cage and could tee off and use his volume punching to great effect. Condit must have watched the tapes and knew to stay away from the pocket at all costs.
So..
does this mean Cecil Peoples thinks leg kicks win fights?
Scrawl - February 5, 2012
Lol
He’s finally come around.
Snatchl - February 5, 2012
Diaz outstruck Condit in rounds 1-3, not including "leg jabs"
And he took back control in round 5.
I score it 49-46 Diaz.
unambig - February 5, 2012
aaaaaaaaaaaaaand
you’d be wrong
Cory Braiterman - February 5, 2012
Correct.
Mesonto - February 6, 2012
How many steps forward did Nick Diaz take, for how long in this fight did condit spend "exiting"
also round 5 get a TD, advance position, threaten == nothing
C’est la vie
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ - February 5, 2012
That is the biggest problem I have...how was rd 5 not Diaz across the board?
Even though I understand him losing, how did 2/3 not give him rd 5?
Snatchl - February 5, 2012
Well i have a friend who's a boxing fan.
He thought the takedown wasn’t a big deal, and i understand, because he’s a boxing guy… and maybe the judges have been hearing so much shit about takedowns not being a big deal, that they decided that wasn’t a big deal.
Obviously this was a different sort of takedown, which immediately became a back mount.
But fuck.. don’t let it go to the judges!
insamniac - February 5, 2012
There has to be a balance
Takedowns are offense, but shouldn’t be weighed more than strikes.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
Don't forget the advanced position, to be fair.
It wasn’t like he just took him down and laid in full guard for the end of the round.
Zachary Kater - February 5, 2012
Truth
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
A takedown is bigger than almost any single strike. But a takedown should not be more than every OTHER strike in that round.
This did not come play in this fight, but is something that I believe in
fbihop - February 5, 2012
Condit outstruck Diaz marginally in round 5
But Diaz’s back mount secures the round in my books.
unambig - February 5, 2012
1 min 20 sec on the ground
1 1/2 min on the ground,leaves 3 1/2 minutes that he got his ass kicked. So if you control a guy for 1 1/2 min , you lose to the guy that controlled you for 3 1/2 minutes in my book for sure. Thats the way i saw it for real,bro!
gotyacoldjunk - February 5, 2012
Why should a fighter be rewarded for walking forward
when that fighter is perpetually walking right into a hard low kick? Condit landed the better quantity and quality of strikes. Get over it.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
How many of those ‘hard low kicks’ did Condit land? Do you really think ANYONE could take that many ‘hard’ kicks to the leg? So how did Diaz retain his ability to move forward? Because most of those kicks were not hard.
Condit turned the match into point sparring and was rewarded with a belt.
Redconsensus - February 5, 2012
At least twenty,
and Nick wasn’t moving forward, or throwing aggressively in the later rounds. In fact he looked downright passive. Creep forward, get hit, lunge with wild punches, miss, rinse repeat, leg kick, creep forward, throw, get cracked, etc. That was the vast majority of the fight.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
diaz wasnt moving forward?
ok
bert44 - February 5, 2012
Like I said, he was just creeping forward
in the later rounds, hardly throwing, passively waiting on Carlos, and getting schooled the entire time until he finally managed to get it to the ground. Where were you? Carlos landed first the entire time, and Nick’s right leg was jelly by the 4th.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
We know
He got outstruck in 4 and 5. But he won rounds 1-3 so it shouldn’t have mattered.
unambig - February 5, 2012
He got outstruck in all five by a good margin.
Only round that’s really debatable was the fifth. Moving forward without landing is like a kamikaze charge, you look proud and brave but you’re getting carved up.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
He didn't
I provided the numbers for you below
unambig - February 5, 2012
Diaz kept moving forward
because he is an otherworldly tough motherfucker. But he noticeably slowed down the more the low kicks accrued, and the more the rounds dragged on. Carlos buckled him with a low kick in the championship rounds!
It wasn’t point sparring, it’s called striking. Diaz’ face doesn’t look like ground beef right now because Carlos was throwing little girl punches and kicks.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
He should've took it to the ground sooner,
if he was capable. Too dumb and proud to know he was losing.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
I don't think he would've subbed Condit TBH,
and Diaz isn’t exactly a takedown machine. He tried a few takedowns to no avail.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
I don't either,
but he could’ve changed the rhythym of the fight and done some damage. He just kept on with the same tired act, even after it was apparent that Carlos wasn’t going to lose his cool. I know Nick acted like he wasn’t hurt, he won, he got “ran from” but from where I sat, he got beat on for much of the fight, lost his initiative due to the leg kicks and counters, and did little but posture while refusing to alter his tactics. Oh well, I wanted and thought Carlos would win, but I was pretty disappointed in Nick, not to mention the post-fight.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Agree completely.
I expected the post- fight tantrum, although I don’t want him to retire.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
Hell no, me neither.
I was just getting to like him again, and there are SO many good fights for him, most of which he’ll win. Carlos composure and ability to laugh off the taunts with vicious kicks in response isn’t something too many guys will replicate.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
I really like Diaz/ Koscheck.
Timeline matches up perfectly
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
Yep, I will watch that:)
And that’ll be the hatefest Nick thrives on.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Plus, Nick always has exciting scramblefests against strong wrestlers.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
I wonder though,
Josh is the kind of guy who seems susceptible to talk, who’ll get pissed off and wade in rather than imposing his wrestling, but we’ve seen him psychologically rope-a-dope Daley that way, by keeping his cool and just winning. It could look similar, but Nick at least has the ground game to be a huge threat there.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Yeah, I don't think Kos is dumb enough to stand and trade with Diaz.
He doesn’t have the skillset to replicate Condit’s game, he needs to use a similar game to what Diego beat Nick with.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
The decisions were weird all night long
I thought Pierce won his fight with Koscheck. But it wasn’t a robbery.
unambig - February 5, 2012
No, the Pierce decision wasn't a robbery.
I thought he lander the cleaner strikes though. I wonder how heavily the takedowns were weighed.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
Well, why would he think he was losing?
He was outstriking Carlos in rounds 1-3.
unambig - February 5, 2012
"Outstriking"
Round 1: Condit- 30 total strikes (29 = “significant strikes”); Diaz- 28 total strikes (23 “significant”)
Round 2: Condit- 29 total strikes (29 = “significant strikes”); Diaz- 35 total strikes (32 = “significant”)
Round 3: Condit- 33 total strikes (32 = “significant strikes”); Diaz- 24 total strikes (22 “significant”)
Round 2 is the only round where Diaz had better #’s than Condit.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
You're counting leg jabs as equal to the power shots that bent Carlos' head backwards and caused him to run for his life
unambig - February 5, 2012
lol at "leg jabs"
Those lead low kicks were snapping Nick’s legs around considerably. j
And do you realize that Nick only landed 8 power shots to the head? Diaz did much better work to the body than the head. Carlos actually outlanded Nick in power strikes to the head.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
The stats say you're wrong.
And so do my eyes. Nick had one moment the whole fight where he beat up Carlos to the body. Other than that he landed a few good punches, while eating far more of them, and getting hammered to the leg and body to the point that he couldn’t push forward in the later rounds, and his reaction time and aggression were shot.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
18 strong leg kicks and 50 “jab” kicks
http://blog.fightmetric.com/2012/02/condit-vs-diaz-official-ufc-statistics.html
Day Man - February 5, 2012
Ahh, glad these came out so fast.
Condit outlanded Diaz in total strikes and significant strikes. In every round but the 2’nd.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
I still thought Diaz landed the harder strikes
But I can respect the decision either way, especially know that the numbers are out.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
Dude, you are a generally reasonable man,
so I’m gonna have to rewatch this. I actually didn’t think there was any doubt.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Those baby kicks sold the judges
unambig - February 5, 2012
Those baby kicks completely shut down Nick's offense.
And they were enough to bust his leg up to where he couldn’t move and land anything before Carlos hammered him and disappeared.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Hard low kicks?
Or “leg jabs”. I saw Carlos’ head getting snapped back like a pinata for the first three rounds
unambig - February 5, 2012
people's and jarman
People’s and jarman need to be RNCd unconscious then let’s how they judge the 5th round.
TheMushroomWizard - February 5, 2012 via iPhone app
Funny thing is
Diaz didn’t GET the RNC on Condit. Nor did he land any hard strikes from that position. Nor did he finish an armbar.
I don’t think a fighter should be rewarded for failing to lock in a submission, no more than a fighter should be rewarded for shutting down that submission attempt.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
To be fair your ideas on judging submission attempts are fairly extreme
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
I don't think they are.
Submissions are completely hit or miss. You either draw the tap, or you don’t. In some cases, you can crank a submission hold and do considerable damage without getting a submission (physical/ verbal tapout, or technical submission), but you still do some serious damage (Marshall breaking Vera’s arm with the armbar comes to mind, Dos Anjos’ round 2 calf slicer on Tyson Griffin that made him limp the rest of the fight).
But Diaz did zero damage with that RNC attempt. It’s not like he was crushing Condit’s face or anything.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
Well it goes down to the fundamental issue we disagree on
The concept of judging offense or damage.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
I guess it does then.
You must break through the fog of lies the
JediUnified Rules have created around you. Let me help you to know the subtleties of theForcefight game. It is unavoidable. With each passing moment you make yourself more my servant!ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
These ARE NOT the droids I'm looking for.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
It depends
if a fighter was really close on finishing a submission, I think there should be points for that. If they just do nothing but attempt at a sub but is shut down, then they get no points.
av1o3 - February 5, 2012
The only time I agree
is a ‘saved by the bell’ situation. I think that the rules need to be changed so that a fighter has to fight his way out of a submission before they can break for the round.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
Back mount in a close round usually secures the round
What did Carlos do in round 5 that wins him that round?
unambig - February 5, 2012
Well, Condit comprehensively outstruck Diaz in the 5'th round, for one
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
That's the one he might have won. I gave him that one, as all else was pretty even in that round.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Here's how I had it
Round 1 – Condit
Round 2 – Diaz
Round 3 – Condit
Round 4 – Condit
Round 5 – Diaz
YPG - February 5, 2012
I agree expect for round 1.
It really lookd like the second round, Carlos couldn’t get any offense going on. He just started to outland Diaz on round 3.
zzwab - February 5, 2012
The weird thing is I'd give Carlos round 3
But round 1 Diaz was just dominant
unambig - February 5, 2012
I had it the same. I have no idea how 2/3 of the judges scored the third for Diaz. Carlos lit Diaz up in that round.
feniin - February 5, 2012
Yep, that’s how Kamijo scored it, and I agree.
Simen - February 5, 2012
I had round 2 as a 10-10, too close to tell, making it 49-47 Condit.
T.C. Engel - February 5, 2012
Diaz slapped Condit IN THE FACE in round 2
lol
unambig - February 5, 2012
Diaz bitch slap gif please
invinciblearmour. - February 5, 2012
how do you score rounds 1 and 2 for condit
but 3 for diaz? Isn’t the 3rd round where condit really started working his gameplan perfectly?
Tats16 - February 5, 2012
Yes it is
Im with you, I really dont get it.
zzwab - February 5, 2012
Please no threats or insults aimed at the judges
Nate Wilcox - February 5, 2012
WHY? They suck ass.
Dougsname - February 5, 2012
Because Rule #4
Damon O. - February 5, 2012
I feel that two of these judges (I WON'T SAY WHICH) are painfully, and woefully inept at their career choices.
And I greatly dislike when I find out that they are assigned to important fights that I care about. That’s not an insult, as much as it is an opinion.
The Hamburger Pimp - February 5, 2012
By insults do you mean questioning their competence to accurately score an MMA fight?
unambig - February 5, 2012
Got pierce scorecard?
Afrotikiman - February 5, 2012 via mobile
actually i wanna see this too
I think pierce got robbed
DK_Monster - February 5, 2012
It was super close
I had Pierce winning 29-28 but it wasn’t a robbery like this one
unambig - February 5, 2012
Alex got robbed too
inthepipes - February 5, 2012
Maybe if he didn't like to kick dick so much
He wouldn’t have lost that decision. Then again, who knows how much impact those dick shots had on Figeroa’s performance?
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
Didn't Reinhardt take Figeroa's back?
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
I actually haven't seen that fight.
I make it a point not to watch any fight involving Jason Reinhardt
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
I think he did
That’s actually why I picked Bruce Leeroy to win. I thought the stand up was about even and he had a huge grappling advantage.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
Alex would've won the decision without the flagrant nut shots IMO
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
I agree
But I thought taking away two points was a bit extreme.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
I thought throwing sloppy ass leg kicks that lifted the guy off the mat with the impact to his groin was a bit extreme.
Zachary Kater - February 5, 2012
I've never seen a 2 point deduction like that before either,
but I think it’s fair. 2 points for 2 nut shots on 2 balls in 2 separate rounds. I like the consistency
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
One of those can change a fight completely. I hate that a fighter feels forced to continue even after getting his manhood pulverized.
Zachary Kater - February 5, 2012
Figeroa is tough, for sure.
It’s a dilemma for the fighter, definitely.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
I think he should have taken away a point immediatly if that was the case for the first kick
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
I liked how Herb gave him a "strong warning"
The connotation being “Look- I know that was an accident… DON’T let it happen again.”
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
I just think that two points is extreme
For an accidental foul. If it was intentional I’d understand.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
There’s a difference between unavoidable accidents and accidents due to negligence.
Zachary Kater - February 5, 2012
If it's repeated after a warning,
it has to be a point, consistently, to buck the trend of having a few “fouls to give”, though I thought two was harsh, and a bitter pill for Alex after a pretty hugely improved performance. Dominant last two rounds.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
I don't think that two point deductions have a place in MMA
You might as well disqualify the guy, because very few can come back from that.
discoandherpes - February 8, 2012
I loved that.
Herb took control all over the board tonight, though I did think Kos should lose a point. People might complain based on precedent, but Herb set it to a degree tonight. For years, the punishment for repeated illegal strikes have been ignored, with the result that people know they have a few get out of jail free cards. A few more performances like that from Herb, and you won’t see that shit when he’s in there. Hope the other refs take his lead.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
I wasn’t around to see the reaction on here during the live thread, but I thought he was way too overzealous with resetting fights.
Zachary Kater - February 5, 2012
The resets were a bit too much,
but that seems like a trend in all the refs. I really LOVED him taking a strong stand against the “fouls to give” mentality some guys have. I realize most fouls are unintentional, but once you’ve been warned once, it should always be a point. You have to be accurate, and while Alex looked much improved, he’s still a wildman out there to a degree. You can’t just throw with no regard for where they land, and I hope Herb blazes the path with that. Also, the way he handled Figueroa’s time to recover, the warnings to Kos, though they should’ve resulted in a point IMO. Apart from resetting too aggressively, I thought Herb’s performance should be a standard to apply.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Had it 48-47 Diaz
1st: Diaz
2nd: Diaz
3rd: Condit
4th: Condit
5th: Diaz
Sweet Scientist - February 5, 2012
I had it the same way.
purplehazelett - February 5, 2012
the first roud is very close. No reason to cry robbery.
Sweet Scientist - February 5, 2012
2nd round wasnt even close. Condit all day
inthepipes - February 5, 2012
Hm, you sure about that
Round 2:
Diaz 35-29 in total strikes
19-9 to the head
15-9 to the body
Condit got 11-1 in kicks, 7 of which were leg jabs.
10-9 Diaz, easily.
unambig - February 5, 2012
on mute with no numbers,
the pitter patter shots go as jabs
inthepipes - February 5, 2012
Yeah, coming from a guy whose username is "sweet scientist."
You’re a good poster, and I’m not personally attacking you, but it’s obvious that you have a bias for boxing. Which is fine, we all have our preferences.
But I don’t think there’s any doubt that Condit landed the harder, cleaner, more numerous strikes throughout the fight.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
That's a fair point.
Honestly I’m not bitching about the decision, and it’s true that I tend to weigh boxing a bit more. Anything from 49-46 Condit to 48-47 Diaz is reasonable for me.
Sweet Scientist - February 5, 2012
Good to hear.
I knew you were a reasonable man. I can understand why a queensbury rules pugilist might score the fight for Diaz.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
WAIT A MINUTE!
There’s such thing as a friendly argument that doesn’t dissolve into name calling?
….I’m disappointed in both of you…
flyingkneetoface - February 5, 2012
I know, Sweet Scientist is a gentleman and a scholar.
Normally when I call someone biased, I’m all like
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
Kevin Hart reference?
That’s a rec
flyingkneetoface - February 5, 2012
Laugh at My Pain was epic IMO
AWRIGHT AWRIGHT AWRI-IGHT!!!
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
Honestly had it the same way
Although I did watch it at a sports bar, and Ive always found that watching it again at home leaves me with a completly different view of the fight
PDG27 - February 5, 2012
I scored it the same.
I could see a (weak) argument for Condit getting round 2 – but there is not fucking way that Condit took 4 rounds.
Redconsensus - February 5, 2012
This is exactly right
Although Diaz might have eeked out the 3rd as well. Oddly the judges seem to feel most strongly about the 3rd for Diaz
unambig - February 5, 2012
1, 2, 5 – Diaz
3, 4 – Condit
DK_Monster - February 5, 2012
1 and 2 were close
but I slightly favored Condit in the first one.
av1o3 - February 5, 2012
Round 1:
Condit 30-28 in strikes BUT
Diaz 16-7 in head shots
Diaz 11-7 in body shots
Condit 16-1 in kicks with 11 of those “leg jabs”
Diaz 10-9 by damage
unambig - February 5, 2012
Diaz nuthuggers
2,3,4 to Condit , 1,5 Diaz.
CyLoke - February 5, 2012
Wasn’t round 2 better than the first one for Diaz in term of punchs landed ?
zzwab - February 5, 2012
Yes it was
He also slapped Condit in the face
unambig - February 5, 2012
seriously to say diaz had 3 damn rounds in this fight is just laughable come on you cant be this up someones ass
Mac Marley - February 5, 2012
Isn't a stretch.
anything from 49-46 Condit to 48-46 Diaz is reasonable.
Sweet Scientist - February 5, 2012
No,
no score giving this to Diaz is reasonable. Moving forward doesn’t matter when you’re getting owned nearly every time you do, unless you’re Leonard Garcia.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Did you award Kalib Starnes a win over Nate Quarry too
unambig - February 5, 2012
Seeing you roll in here late to desperately troll every sensible comment in this post,
makes Carlos winning SO much sweeter. I thank you for your weak, stalking patronage!
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
This is coming from a guy who's been waiting to say "Fuck you Nick Diaz" for some time.
Clearly unbiased.
Zachary Kater - February 5, 2012
Mac Marley is a special individual
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
If you eliminate Carlos' dubious 50 "leg jabs"
You get 62-55 for Diaz in head strikes
And 49-36 in body shots for Diaz
unambig - February 5, 2012
To give Condit the 5th round is pretty bad in my eyes. I scored it 48-47 Diaz, with him winning 1, 2, and 5. I could see giving Condit round 1 or 2, as they were pretty close. But round 5 to Condit?
xDieseLx - February 5, 2012
Yeah, the 5th round scores are weird. I had 1 and 5 to Diaz with the last being a very strong round.
Scrawl - February 5, 2012
Condit may not have "won" but he definitively didn't lose.
NEW-HAMPSHIRE - February 5, 2012
On the UFC website I found this
Ref should have issued warning for Condit turning is back and running.
Ionnes - February 5, 2012
That wasn't running for the last time
Did you want him to just stand there with his back against the cage where Diaz is best?
He slipped Diaz’s punches and countered to get away, that is not running.
av1o3 - February 5, 2012
God you are annoying.
Nothing but complaining and instigating all night.
Tim Bernier - February 5, 2012
If Condit was avoiding contact
he wouldn’t have landed the dozens upon dozens of hard low kicks, high kicks, and punches that he landed.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
Go away with your silliness.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Not falling into your opponents game plan ≠timidity.
toxic - February 5, 2012
Seriously.
Moving blindly straight forward is no measure of “winning” in any form of combat, from large scale armies to hand to hand, in any of human history. In fact, it’s been shown to be utterly stupid when confronted by an equal opposition. Carlos just sniped him while Nick bitched, talked and took a beating.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Good thing
Condit isn’t guilty of violating any of those points.
AusEagle - February 5, 2012
Are you serious. This might be the most idiotic comment I’ve read on this website.
T.C. Engel - February 5, 2012
You must not be a fan of ketchup.
Zachary Kater - February 5, 2012
I have that comment bookmarked. ketchup is stupid and disgusting.
T.C. Engel - February 5, 2012
I've always enjoyed reading the comments on this site
But the comments after this fight have been excruciatingly bad.
Violent Newt - February 5, 2012
That's fucking ridicuous.
Sweet Scientist - February 5, 2012
Sigh.
You would be better off walking around your house punching some walls to let off some steam than to come on the internet and quote the unified rules in an illogical and incongruent fashion to support your trash hypothesis and make a fool of yourself.
Condit did NOT avoid contact (he landed hundreds of strikes on Diaz, more than Diaz did in return) and he sure as shit did not spit out his mouthpiece or fake an injury.
Avoiding damage while inflicting it is not against the rules. So tell me, why the fuck should the ref have issued a warning again?
BiscoBisco - February 5, 2012
Except all the time he ran away with his back to Nick Looking over his shoulder.
Jackson MMA has turned these fights into humping or running matches. Enjoy Ultimate Legkick running if thats what you like, but i believe he was breaking the spirit of that rule I listed when it comes to timidity. First thing he did was timidly explain it was all his corner’s idea after the fight too.
Ionnes - February 5, 2012
49-46 condit
That’s what I saw.
We All Hate Caleb - February 5, 2012 via mobile
Yep. Wasn't hard to score.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
If GSP is out till November, can we just do this fight again in July?
xDieseLx - February 5, 2012
Diaz winning. Please Homie, not even
inthepipes - February 5, 2012
kinghaze - February 5, 2012
I had it 49-46.
Talk about making somebody quit! Hahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Oh and FUCK YES!!!!
Nick can smoke through a bong full of tears till the sheep come home.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
I had 49-46 as well
For Diaz
unambig - February 5, 2012
Yes I noticed your crazy...
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
wow dana is pissed at the lack of microphones lol
Tats16 - February 5, 2012
How do PEoples and JArmin give round 5 to Condit!!!
MaZZacare - February 5, 2012
Yeah, I agree, but no way it mattered in the decision.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Jeteyes - February 5, 2012
So many lurkers popped up out of no where to complain that the fight was a “robbery”. I think I found the one thing I hate more than Nick Diaz. His stupid, fucking fans.
kreally - February 5, 2012
Ouch
I’m a Diaz fan, and I thought we were now bros.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
Not you.
The stupid butt hurt ones that are complaining about a robbery.
kreally - February 5, 2012
I got you
MMA fans are too jumpy with the word robbery. Any close fight is a robbery according to them.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
Dude, I was a fucking Diaz fan too.
Then he bitched about the loss and said he was going to retire. Come on.
kreally - February 5, 2012
That surprised you?
Bobby Flay - February 5, 2012
He’s never been one to take his losses with grace.
AusEagle - February 5, 2012
Speaking of the prospects, how'd you do?
kreally - February 5, 2012
67
Not too good.
For some reason I changed Natal by UD to the other dude by tko. I thought he was going to do it in the third, but it just wasn’t meant to be. I also picked Pierce, and that backfired.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
Dude, fucking hilarious.
I changed Kuiper from tko in the second to Natal by UD. Talk about coincidence. I walked away with 98 points tonight. I lost on Caceres (I thought he won the decision) and Nick.
kreally - February 5, 2012
That is pretty funny
Congrats man. Good stuff.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
Thanks, bro.
Should I expect the prospects update in the fanposts tomorrow?
kreally - February 5, 2012
Wonderfulspam is including them in his recap
So I’ll be sending him the results tonight.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
i think i fount something even worse
someone who cries about something stupid and basically is doing the same thing lol
BIGNAT - February 5, 2012
You must either be a Diaz hater yourself, or have skipped a good 25% of the comments post-fight on here.
Zachary Kater - February 5, 2012
I was a huge fan of his right up to that post fight speech.
His hardcore fans that want to proclaim this a robbery are the ones getting on my nerves.
kreally - February 5, 2012
And the hardcore Diaz haters are doing the same for me. There is a middle ground, people!
Zachary Kater - February 5, 2012
Apparently not.
kreally - February 5, 2012
rec X a million
i don’t hate Diaz, but his fans are just unbearable
darkotto23 - February 5, 2012
Hopefully DFW says he doesnt agree with the judging
Sets up an immediate rematch and Diaz figures out a way to counter or keep Condit from escaping to the left with his head down eveytime he’s pressed against the cage.
ScoreCardOTN - February 5, 2012 via mobile
Dana just said he agreed
Diaz rounds 1 and 2, condit rest of the 3.
Tats16 - February 5, 2012
Dana agreed that back mount in round 5 is meaningless
unambig - February 5, 2012
Dana White has a history of ignoring dominant positions
He also has a history of saying stupid things.
discoandherpes - February 8, 2012
Why, Diaz turned bitch, took his ball and went home.
Get over it. He got owned in every way. Carlos landed more good punches, and kicked the shit out of his legs. Done.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
I thought Diaz landed the cleaner shots.
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
Nah. I saw the punching as slightly favoring Carlos,
plus fifty wicked leg kicks. Game over.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
I didn't really see Condit committing too much to his punches
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
I can't comment on his committment LOL,
but they were landing and stopping Nick in his tracks for the majority of the fight. Nick snapped Carlos head back a few times, and beat him up to the body for about ten seconds total, but he also ran into plenty of hard jabs and elbows. You can criticize Carlos committment and metaphysical sense of their impact on Nick’s being, whereas I can just say that Nick missed most of the time.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
For the record in punching:
Round 1: Diaz 27-14
Round 2: Diaz 34-18 (not even close)
Round 3: Diaz 23-18
Round 4: Condit 20-10
Round 5: Condit 21-17
unambig - February 5, 2012
Yeah Carlos' hair was sore with all that wind.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Those were landed strikes
You saw what you wanted to see I guess. Personally, I saw Carlos running for 3 rounds. He settled down in 4-5 and fought well. I’d give it 48-47 Diaz to be fair to his leg jabs.
unambig - February 5, 2012
He was running, and outstriking Nick the whole way,
so you trust the stats, but not their conclusion. LOL. You’re clearly distraught, so I’ll just leave you to that. Don’t quit like your boy.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Although in my mind I'm 100% sure Diaz won that fight I also accept you saw it different
So I’m fine leaving it there. Clearly opinion is divided down the middle. If I were crazy it would just be me. But that’s not the case.
unambig - February 5, 2012
Actually you couldn't be more wrong if you tried
He was outstruck. He landed more leg jabs.
unambig - February 5, 2012
Lorenzo already said that isn’t happening.
Dana wants Diaz vs Kos.
AusEagle - February 5, 2012
Also, why are we using Compustrike?
When Fightmetric is consistently superior?
discoandherpes - February 5, 2012
I though Condit won but I thought it was pretty clear Diaz won round 1
Frank Lee - February 5, 2012
It was a toss up on rd 1 for me.
Rd 5 was his though.
kreally - February 5, 2012
Wait, so Condit could have gotten the Herb Dean two point deduction and still won? Crazy.
Day Man - February 5, 2012
Someone just suggested Koscheck vs Diaz
…..hope that doesn’t happen
Frank Lee - February 5, 2012
Dana already suggesting it.
AusEagle - February 5, 2012
I don't think I've ever seen a fight that has divided BE
as bitterly as this one. I think I just decided to never speak of it again. Someone tell me how GSP-Condit turns out.
Dave Strummer - February 5, 2012
yeah feels like 50% in here
Frank Lee - February 5, 2012
Yeap...
49-46, GSP, easily.
Captain Beyond - February 5, 2012
Were you not around for Machida/Shogun 1?
Hell, by internet standards this is a cordial debate.
toxic - February 5, 2012
BE UN-CIVIL WAR SEASON 1
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
I thought Diaz won 3 rounds to 2 although I could see it going Condit's way, also 3 to 2.
My only issue is with the 49-46 scorecards. I don’t think either one of them did enough to win four rounds in that fight.
The Hamburger Pimp - February 5, 2012
I thought 48-47 could go either way but when I heard 49-46 read out I was certain Diaz won
Since Diaz clearly won one of the first 3 rounds and the 5th.
unambig - February 5, 2012
can we get the gif of the slap
Frank Lee - February 5, 2012
Am I allowed to post GIFs in here?
without getting banned
Frank Lee - February 5, 2012
People need to realize
avoiding getting cornered while consistently landing strikes (including several headkicks) is not running
xicer - February 5, 2012
reply fail, this was meant to go in the main thread
xicer - February 5, 2012
Turning your back after landing said combo
is running though…. that is my point. Back turned and all.
Ionnes - February 5, 2012
Yes and spinning backfists are illegal attempts to interfere with the atmospheric pressure in the area of the opposing fighter...
you sad hater!!!
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Obvious troll
is obvious.
Ionnes - February 5, 2012
Yes,says the guy who wants every fight stopped
when a guy gives up his back. We know who the troll is, but you make yourself feel better. Go ahead, it’s common.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
A-S-S
Are the first 3 letters in assumption.
Ionnes - February 5, 2012
LOL makes a similar sound as the beginning of logic.
Now get some. You post is stupid, and you know it is. I hate it when a guy cries in front of me.
Kwisatz Haderach - February 5, 2012
Still trolling 3 hours after my post?
Get a life.
Ionnes - February 5, 2012
Is it you?
BiscoBisco - February 5, 2012
When did MMA become who can brawl better?
Frank Lee - February 5, 2012
So... you were pleased with this "fight?"
Bobby Flay - February 5, 2012
I’m goin to have to rewatch the fight… The first 2 were close but I think Condit got 3 and 4 and Diaz got the 5th
rscott94 - February 5, 2012
to the 5% who voted 50-45 either way...
darkotto23 - February 5, 2012
i actually gave all 5 rounds to condit
then got on BE and i see i’m pretty much alone on this one….
i need to rewatch it!
invinciblearmour. - February 5, 2012
really?
I thought Nick won the 2nd, and i also gave him the 5th because of the back control and sub attempts
darkotto23 - February 5, 2012
I rewatched it
Diaz 48-47
invinciblearmour. - February 8, 2012
i loved nick's hissy fit
Johnathan Willis - February 5, 2012
I had Diaz winning
Close enough fight, Shouldn’t be able to win a title pretty much in retreat. How many watched the fight with no sound?
rumblybob - February 5, 2012
Me and felt that Condit one pretty soundly
Afrotikiman - February 5, 2012 via mobile
The weirdest thing about the scorecards is that the third round was the least convincing round Diaz won
Diaz won Rounds 1,2 and 5. That the judges scored 1, 2 and 5 for Condit literally makes my head explode.
unambig - February 5, 2012
I gave rounds 1, 2 and 5 and while I was watching I thought everybody would.
Bolshevik - February 5, 2012
Gave them to Diaz. It’s been a long night.
Bolshevik - February 5, 2012
Interestingly, if we judged this fight on Nick’s own criteria (i.e. who’s face was more fucked up after the fight), surely Diaz would have to concede that he had the bigger shiner under his right eye?
BiscoBisco - February 5, 2012
I just thought he was sponsored by nike
Cory Braiterman - February 5, 2012
Man I'm done this this game, I quit, man, yknow, I don't need this shit
What are the odds he has a fight before Condit does?
Erasedhead - February 5, 2012
I really want to see him fight Koscheck.
Or maybe rematch Diego, their fight was epic.
ElliotMatheny - February 5, 2012
Pretty even fight, and pretty dissapointing
In that neither guy really did a whole lot of damage with their power shots. At the time, I thought Condit should have won, but that the judges would favour Nick for walking forward. Condit did a good job circling away from the power shots and chopping away at Nick.
The way I see it is that aggressiveness is only a deciding factor when it is effective. This fight was the equivalent of two fencers going at it, one swinging for the fences and the other picking his shots.
Erasedhead - February 5, 2012
I said it last night, before the fight,
Diaz lost half the fight to BJ kind of like how he lost last night (his opponent moving away from his grizzlie bear attack), until he finally backed BJ against the cage and could tee off and use his volume punching to great effect. Condit must have watched the tapes and knew to stay away from the pocket at all costs.
Erasedhead - February 5, 2012
I felt the decision was right...
As far as Condit winning, but the way the individual rounds were scored was a joke.
Violent Newt - February 5, 2012
Condit will be such a great track star!
What is his distance anyway?
Mesonto - February 6, 2012
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